Camaro team's response to concern about Transmission Output Shaft Failure

[UCF w00t]

Originally Posted by multiSS

Question; When GM does warranty an output shaft, do they replace it with the same part (part#). Or is there an upgrade?

They replace the whole transmission with the same part # (pretty sure its the same).

Originally Posted by brjray

Is this report posted on the GM SI site? I would like to see the report prior to purchase. I had non output shaft problems with the manual transmission in my GTO and I do not want to repeat with the transmission issues.

Thanks!

First post of this thread is it. There's no "report".

Originally Posted by daddyuhoh

No worries, I have an auto SS.............

Thanks, we were all just DIEING to know if you had an auto or stick. Now we can all sleep easy!

[UCF w00t]

Originally Posted by brjray

I thought it said in the first post that a group of engineers did a study over a period of several weeks and found the number of failures to be acceptable. Are their notes and graphs on post its? To determine this they had to use statistics. I am not intending to come off as rude or smug. I took an engineering course in college and the instructor was a project manager for the new Cummins common rail diesel engine. One of our projects involved a real world cummins issue where the manifold was cracking and we had to do a report that he had already done. It ended up being unacceptable number of failures and there was a recall. They replaced part of the pipe with a flex tube to keep it from cracking under thermal stress.

Would be interesting to see the "normal driving" criteria and also how many failures there were in the full data set. You can plug this data into a statistics software and analyze it. You vary different criteria and get T values if i remember correctly. From that you determine what the critical factors are to the parts failure.

Most of you dont care to see this I'm sure. Long story short I want to see if it will go bang under a hard shift!

Oh of course it "exists". We'll never see it though. That's not the kind of thing companies share and would certainly be considered proprietary.

[Wesman]

I believe that GM issues the response that they did is because they don't make the transmission. The 6 speed manual in the SS is a Tremec TR6060, same as those used in GT500's and Vipers.

I'm sure GM made Tremec aware of the problem, but I doubt Tremec is going to offer to replace transmissions on the premise that they "might" break when abused. Its just not feasible from any perspective to replace entire transmissions because an unlikely failure of the output shaft may occur.

Not saying it isn't an issue, just that I don't think its anything most owners have to worry about.

[tom692010]

Originally Posted by Paul SS

What is normal driving for a car with 426 horsepower? How does any manufacturer expect people to drive their hi performance cars? I know some people will abuse their cars but you should expect all that horsepower to be enjoyed responsibly.

Exactly my point. They give us 426 hp, have a comp mode, show a video to GM reps at how to use it. And then say drive normally?

On a side note I'm more concerned about the CV joints that have blown out.I spoke with a GM rep at SEMA and he said they hardened the cv joints end but it wasn't until August. So all those produced before,well it's a crap shoot. An though there is a new cv out there you can't get it replaced until it breaks.

[POWERFREAK]

Originally Posted by Wesman

I believe that GM issues the response that they did is because they don't make the transmission. The 6 speed manual in the SS is a Tremec TR6060, same as those used in GT500's and Vipers.

Yes they all have TR6060's (as does the 'Vette and Challenger), but there are different versions of the TR6060 that handle more power (in the more powerful cars).

[Supermans]

Originally Posted by tom692010

Exactly my point. They give us 426 hp, have a comp mode, show a video to GM reps at how to use it. And then say drive normally?

On a side note I'm more concerned about the CV joints that have blown out.I spoke with a GM rep at SEMA and he said they hardened the cv joints end but it wasn't until August. So all those produced before,well it's a crap shoot. An though there is a new cv out there you can't get it replaced until it breaks.

This is why I asked in an earlier post if there are newer stronger parts being put in for a replacement Shaft and the other parts that break when that issue occurs.

[POWERFREAK]

Originally Posted by brjray

The Vipers and Mustangs are not breaking their TR6060 transmissions are they? Could it be drive shaft vibrations breaking the output shaft of the transmission?

I am a bit hesitant to go the route I was thinking of. I had planned on buying a 1SS/RS/stick in April after we move and I can trade in my truck. I guess now I dont have to save up for a Turbonetics turbo kit.. bah!

When the issue first came up, I do remember hearing there were similar issues on other cars w/ the TR6060. Still, of all the breakage reported...I think it's limited to pre 26k vin #'s (which was the time of the M6 "slowdown").

Honestly though if you're spending the money to build a turbo car, you should plan on spending some $$ on trans/rear upgrades at some point, no matter what car is it.

[missionbrent]

Sounds like they are saying it will cost us less to fix the ones that do break then to make a recall regardless if the part is defective. New GM is not instilling a great deal of confidence in me for changing its ways.

I am reminded of the Ford GT's faulty control arms. I beleive they fixed those even before the first one broke when they discovered the problem (and I think it was only for a chance of failure). I beleive they went to the customer's home and fixed the problem. I know th Camaro isn't a Ford GT, but doing nothing doesn't seem right. If the part is faulty then fix it. None of this normal driving condition crap.

All stuff like this will do is cause me to pay coser attention to the 2011 Mustang even though I am a GM fan.

[tom692010]

Originally Posted by Supermans

This is why I asked in an earlier post if there are newer stronger parts being put in for a replacement Shaft and the other parts that break when that issue occurs.

This came straight out of Al Oppenhiemers mouth when I asked him about it.

[Hicompression]

I bust it...GM's gonna give me a new one. End of story.

[leviticus88]

I guess, as always, It all comes down to your faith in the factory warranty as to whether this was a satisfactory answer from GM. But, props to them for atleast giving an answer!

As far as my GM warranty experience on a total of 4 Performance Minded GM Models, it's all about what dealership you decide to have the warranty work done at and how you approach the issue with the service guys.

My advice: Make smart modding decisions and use quality parts and understand the risks involved. Pick a respectable dealer. Understand that the vehicle was designed with tolerances in mind and was built on a budget and at some point the line is drawn between factory defect and abuse caused failure. Don't abuse the car but enjoy it for what it can do. And be fair to your dealer and you should have no issues with any warranty work on any part.

[losjohnny]

Thanks for the information and support. Great to know our forum gets that kind of response.

[JusticePete]

Originally Posted by brjray

Does anyone mind saying how their failure occurred again?

Great question.

[The_Blur]

Are we still discussing this? This is why we have warranties, people! If something breaks, they fix it. We think that this part could brake on a very small number of cars under no particular circumstances. Even racing your Camaro will not cause this part to break. If it does break, then you're covered just like any other part on the car.